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From: George on 2 Sep 2009 08:08
> On Aug 29, 12:13 pm, "OhioGuy" <n...(a)none.net> wrote:
>> I've noticed a disturbing trend over the past few months - more and more
>> places are putting up signs saying "we do not accept any bills larger than
>> As someone who has switched over to using a cash budget to help control
>> spending, this is making life difficult.
>> I saw the new sign yesterday at a gas station I fuel up at occasionally -
>> now $20 is the largest bill they accept. With current gas prices, it costs
>> about $40 or so to fill up - 80% of that $50 bill they won't accept.
>> 50 years ago, there were $500 and $1,000 bills in circulation. With
>> inflation, that $50 bill they won't take any more only buys what $8.50
>> bought in 1969. In other words, you already have to carry around 6 times as
>> much money to buy the same things.
>> I don't understand why stores are legally able to get away with refusing
>> to accept legal tender dollars. It says right on the bills that they are to
>> be accepted as legal tender for all debts, public and private.
>> Any thoughts?
> Dude - you've gotta join the 21st Century. They can legally do it
> because there are no laws to prevent it.
> It's been years since I've been in a gas station or convenience store
> without one of those $20 Bill signs. And many of them don't accept
> accept cash at all after a certain hour. My doctor and dentist both
> stopped taking cash or checks for copays a couple of years ago. And
> I've recently started seeing No Cash or Checks signs in some of the
> restaurants I frequent.
> I've got a feeling we're headed to a time when cash isn't accepted
Until for example there is an alternative to cash for say a politician
to be paid a bribe it isn't going to happen. The main driver for a
"cashless" society is the banks (you know those helpless folks we just
bailed out or the world would come to an end?). It would would be really
great for them if they could insert themselves into and make a cut of
You need to develop the discipline to handle your finances
> with a credit/debit card, and in the mean time you'll just have to
> start carrying smaller bills.
From: George on 2 Sep 2009 08:13
The Real Bev wrote:
> Rod Speed wrote:
>> BigDog811 wrote:
>>> I've got a feeling we're headed to a time when cash isn't accepted
>> Thats never going to happen.
> Don't be too sure. Cash is pretty much untreaceable and therefore used
> by criminals. "You aren't a criminal are you, Citizen? So you won't
> mind if we outlaw cash and require that all purchases be made with
> credit or debit cards, right? It's for your own good, Citizen..."
>>> You need to develop the discipline to handle your finances with a
>>> debit card, and in the mean time you'll just have to start carrying
>>> smaller bills.
> I don't see how people can confuse a credit card with the "I don't have
> to worry about how much it costs because I'll never have to pay the
> bill" philosophy.
Because they allow others to think for (and charge dearly for it) them.
Try to get the actual purchase price for a major purchase for example.
Instead its "tell us your credit card payments and how much you make and
we will tell you which car you can "afford"..."
> I do like the Brit expression "on the never-never", though.
From: Dave on 2 Sep 2009 09:28
> OK, so now I'm curious. How many fake 20s was the bank claiming you were
> passed? Fake 20s are a lot more common than fake 50s or fake 100s. So if
> you had a lot of fake 50s, you must have had even more fake 20s. -Dave
>Is there a study of this somewhere?
>I've worked in a grocery store for 20 years now. I've seen a lot of
>fake 50s and 100s, but only one fake $20 bill. So, either the 20s are
>much better quality and don't get caught at the store level (or
>reported to employees). THey hang up the fakes in the breakroom
>sometimes. And they insist that we check all 50s and 100s, but don't
>insist on checking the 20s.
THAT is exactly why the 20 is the most commonly faked currency in the world.
Nobody checks it, making it easier to pass. The reason you've only seen one
fake $20 bill is that you aren't examining $20 bills to see if they are
genuine or not. So the ONE that got caught must have been a really
outrageously bad fake. -Dave
From: SMS on 2 Sep 2009 11:47
> On Aug 31, 1:45 pm, SMS <scharf.ste...(a)geemail.com> wrote:
>> OhioGuy wrote:
>>> I don't understand why stores are legally able to get away with refusing
>>> to accept legal tender dollars. It says right on the bills that they are to
>>> be accepted as legal tender for all debts, public and private.
>> The key word is "debt." If it's a good or service that you pay for in
>> advance then they can refuse cash. Look at the Costco gas stations, none
>> of which accept cash, or a few restaurants that don't take cash, i.e.
>> the "bistro" in the Whole Foods Market near me takes only debit or
>> credit cards (or Whole Foods gift cards). They don't want to deal with
>> cash and the hygiene issues.
>> Now if you already consumed a meal, or stayed in a hotel, and the
>> restaurant refused a $50 bill then they'd be violating federal law, even
>> if they had posted a sign stating this in advance.
> Can I get a cite on that?
Is U.S. currency legal tender for all debts?
According to the "Legal Tender Statute" (section 5103 of title 31 of the
U.S. Code), "United States coins and currency (including Federal Reserve
notes and circulating notes of Federal Reserve banks and national banks)
are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues." This
means that all U.S. money, as identified above, when tendered to a
creditor legally satisfies a debt to the extent of the amount (face
However, no federal law mandates that a person or an organization must
accept currency or coins as payment for goods or services not yet
provided. For example, a bus line may prohibit payment of fares in
pennies or dollar bills.
Some movie theaters, convenience stores and gas stations as a matter of
policy may refuse to accept currency of a large denomination, such as
notes above $20, and as long as notice is posted and a transaction
giving rise to a debt has not already been completed, these
organizations have not violated the legal tender law.
From: The Real Bev on 2 Sep 2009 13:17
Rod Speed wrote:
> The Real Bev wrote
>> Rod Speed wrote
>>> BigDog811 wrote
>>>> I've got a feeling we're headed to a time when cash isn't accepted
>>> Thats never going to happen.
>> Don't be too sure.
> Corse it wont. The US hasnt even had enough of a clue to give up on 1c and
> 2c pieces.
>> Cash is pretty much untreaceable and therefore used by criminals.
> Any criminal with even half a clue uses stolen credit cards.
I'm pretty sure you can't put a ton of cocaine and a medium-size airplane on
your MasterCard, even if it formerly belonged to Bill Gates or the Sultan of
>> "You aren't a criminal are you, Citizen? So you won't mind if we outlaw
>> cash and require that all purchases be made with credit or debit cards,
>> right? It's for your own good, Citizen..."
> The voters wouldnt buy it and the legislators know that.
You must have missed the "for your own good" part. Right now we have way too
many laws "for our own good" and people don't seem to whine much. Didn't
Kennedy keep getting elected?
Never fear, Citizen of Oz, soon we will be watching out for you too...
>>>> You need to develop the discipline to handle your finances with a
>>>> credit/ debit card, and in the mean time you'll just have to start
>>>> carrying smaller bills.
>> I don't see how people can confuse a credit card with the "I don't have to
>> worry about how much it costs because I'll never have to pay the bill"
>> I do like the Brit expression "on the never-never", though.
What part of Oz do you come from?
"The way England treats her prisoners, she doesn't
deserve to have any." --Oscar Wilde