From: funfly3 on
G a z . wrote:
> In article <psmc33ldppnl787dvk01i9me15n43om7va(a)4ax.com>,
> somerat(a)hotmail.com says...
>
>> If you don't leave negs for people who deserve them, you're doing your
>> bit to make the whole system utterly worthless. And if it's worthless,
>> you might as well take the occasional neg and not worry about, right?
>> So have the courage of your convictions!
>>
>
> To be honest Kim, if I really thought that it would do any good, then I
> would not hesitate to give my Non Payer his deserved neg!
>
> However as it is, I think that this buyer, has got a lot more knowledge and
> experience of using eBay then what what his account shows, as you yourself
> might agree there are times when you get a gut feeling about something or
> somebody, so the way I am looking at it is this:
>
> Is there any point of giving somebody a NEG, when they have got a newly
> opened eBay account, with no transactions until now, his feedback score is
> zero, with no transactions (or bidding activity since).
>
> If I were to give him the neg he deserves, what is likely to happen?
>
> 1. He will just open another eBay account, I believe he has already done
> that.
>
> 2. He will happily leave me an undeserved neg by return.
>
> Thus my selling account, that I try and do my best to ensure my paying
> customers are happy, will lose it's perfect 100% (with NO withdrawals)
> feedback rating.
>
> I do find it tiresome that those of you who say that, if you want to earn
> points then get a supermarket loyality card, yet you then say how important
> honest feedback is.
>
> Thing is I agree "Honest" feedback is the reason I am not prepared to risk
> leaving him honest negative feedback, as like I have said he will just
> leave a dishonest neg by return, which eBay will allow to to displayed
> infinitum.
>
> So it is the lesser of two evils for me.
so if we all follow you all the sellers will be less than 100% and all
the buyers would be on 100% as no seller would give anyone a neg and
what point is that, give them a neg loose your 100% it will happen one
day and its no big deal & its not the end of the world , the reply to
the neg will say a lot more than the retaliatory neg ever could
From: Kim Andrews on
On Tue, 1 May 2007 09:59:49 +0100, "michael adams"
<mjadams25(a)onetel.net.uk> wrote:

>Maybe I'm missing something here, but unless as a seller you're going
>to block bids from buyers with "unsatisfactory" feedback * then what
>possible difference does it make what sort of feedback rating a buyers
>has - or is given ? Assuming that dodgy buyers would operate separate
>selling accounts in any case.

It is useful, if you start to have a bad feeling about a deal, or if
somebody asks for some non-standard service, to be able to check their
feedback to get a feel for how advisable the deal is. I actually do
think the feedback system is to some extent worthless at the moment
(if you read my original post you will note the questioning
phraseology) but it's not going to improve if we're frightened of
being honest. At the moment it's obvious from many posts in here that
many sellers are terrified of the feedback system and don't use it in
a meaningful way at all. I am suggesting that if sellers don't have
the courage of their convictions, that situation can never improve.


--
by Kimbo!
Mail-order second-hand books at www.bykimbo.com
Find me on ebay at http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Books-by-Kimbo
From: michael adams on

"Kim Andrews" <somerat(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fr1e33d754520a00pj6vhdoietj7ir0tus(a)4ax.com...
> On Tue, 1 May 2007 09:59:49 +0100, "michael adams"
> <mjadams25(a)onetel.net.uk> wrote:
>
> >Maybe I'm missing something here, but unless as a seller you're going
> >to block bids from buyers with "unsatisfactory" feedback * then what
> >possible difference does it make what sort of feedback rating a buyers
> >has - or is given ? Assuming that dodgy buyers would operate separate
> >selling accounts in any case.
>
> It is useful, if you start to have a bad feeling about a deal, or if
> somebody asks for some non-standard service, to be able to check their
> feedback to get a feel for how advisable the deal is. I actually do
> think the feedback system is to some extent worthless at the moment
> (if you read my original post you will note the questioning
> phraseology) but it's not going to improve if we're frightened of
> being honest. At the moment it's obvious from many posts in here that
> many sellers are terrified of the feedback system and don't use it in
> a meaningful way at all. I am suggesting that if sellers don't have
> the courage of their convictions, that situation can never improve.


Unless there is some way of independently moderating feedback before
it's posted - maybe with a right of reply and cooling off period - to
filter out both the stupid and the malicious, then it's always going
to work in favour of buyers rather than sellers IMO.

This is simply because buyers have potentially much more to lose - as
they're more likely to be judged on their feedback, and because morons
and the deranged are probably more likely to be buyers than sellers, as
there are less hoops for them to jump through. At a guess.

So that even now, from a buyers perspective feedback works perfectly IMO.
Providing they take the trouble to read the comments to filter out the
obvious morons, rather than just go on the bare rating percentage.

However moderating feedback would definitely cost money in terms of
increased fees whichever way you look at it. And whether from a practical
point of view from a sellers perspective it would actualy be worth it in
terms of actual benefits is highly questionable IMO. Whatever the
underlying injustice that remains.


michael adams

....



>
>
> --
> by Kimbo!
> Mail-order second-hand books at www.bykimbo.com
> Find me on ebay at http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Books-by-Kimbo


From: michael adams on
Erratum:second paragraph altered to read -

This is simply because sellers have potentially much more to lose
^^^^^^^^



"Kim Andrews" <somerat(a)hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:fr1e33d754520a00pj6vhdoietj7ir0tus(a)4ax.com...
> On Tue, 1 May 2007 09:59:49 +0100, "michael adams"
> <mjadams25(a)onetel.net.uk> wrote:
>
> >Maybe I'm missing something here, but unless as a seller you're going
> >to block bids from buyers with "unsatisfactory" feedback * then what
> >possible difference does it make what sort of feedback rating a buyers
> >has - or is given ? Assuming that dodgy buyers would operate separate
> >selling accounts in any case.
>
> It is useful, if you start to have a bad feeling about a deal, or if
> somebody asks for some non-standard service, to be able to check their
> feedback to get a feel for how advisable the deal is. I actually do
> think the feedback system is to some extent worthless at the moment
> (if you read my original post you will note the questioning
> phraseology) but it's not going to improve if we're frightened of
> being honest. At the moment it's obvious from many posts in here that
> many sellers are terrified of the feedback system and don't use it in
> a meaningful way at all. I am suggesting that if sellers don't have
> the courage of their convictions, that situation can never improve.


Unless there is some way of independently moderating feedback before
it's posted - maybe with a right of reply and cooling off period - to
filter out both the stupid and the malicious, then it's always going
to work in favour of buyers rather than sellers IMO.

This is simply because sellers have potentially much more to lose - as
they're more likely to be judged on their feedback, and because morons
and the deranged are probably more likely to be buyers than sellers, as
there are less hoops for them to jump through. At a guess.

So that even now, from a buyers perspective feedback works perfectly IMO.
Providing they take the trouble to read the comments to filter out the
obvious morons, rather than just go on the bare rating percentage.

However moderating feedback would definitely cost money in terms of
increased fees whichever way you look at it. And whether from a practical
point of view from a sellers perspective it would actualy be worth it in
terms of actual benefits is highly questionable IMO. Whatever the
underlying injustice that remains.


michael adams

....



>
>
> --
> by Kimbo!
> Mail-order second-hand books at www.bykimbo.com
> Find me on ebay at http://stores.ebay.co.uk/Books-by-Kimbo



From: blackbat on
On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 22:01:20 +0100, G a z . <Spam(a)NoEmail.Com> wrote:

>Again, likewise, seeing as this cnut buyer responded to the UPI dispute,
>eBay will still allow him to leave feedback!


So if he doesn't respond to the UPI dispute he forfeits his right to
leave feedback?
--

blackbat /\x/\